how do you know who is right about swinging a bat

[Safebyahare]

I still don't know doctor. In 2012 I would tell her to let it get deeper. Please dissect.
http://youtu.be/6HkSRr4TOyc

Nice compact and efficient swing. Even though the video is short it seems apparent she has good hand control. No wasted motion. I assume she handle off-speed as well?

This is from 2012 when she was a HS junior, she is now a sophomore in college.
She was a sucker for a change up back then, we incorporated it into our time together.
And is not so much a issue. Depending on, (insert whatever here)

[Safebyahare]

It was always important to add fun. http://youtu.be/YIf-dKmh6hE
or http://youtu.be/BErNK2SL3oU

[jtat32]

I still don't know doctor. In 2012 I would tell her to let it get deeper. Please dissect.
http://youtu.be/6HkSRr4TOyc

Not sure if you are looking for any kind of genetic analysis, but from what I can gather from the clip I am fairly confident that she has an athletic mother.

[jonriv]

I still don't know doctor. In 2012 I would tell her to let it get deeper. Please dissect.
http://youtu.be/6HkSRr4TOyc

Not sure if you are looking for any kind of genetic analysis, but from what I can gather from the clip I am fairly confident that she has an athletic mother.

ouch

[Mark H]

I still don't know doctor. In 2012 I would tell her to let it get deeper. Please dissect.
http://youtu.be/6HkSRr4TOyc

She would be high on my list of kids to watch in games were I a college coach and she an available recruit.

That is very nice of you, thank you. Was looking for more of break down critique, there is always things to improve on.
I have heard of coaches giving multiple lessons at the same time, I have also heard of coaches giving lessons while on the phone with other business.
Was hoping this would be the first web based lesson. A Heybucket first.
It does show what an open field and cell phone offers.
Note all went center/right. I know there must have been an outside pitch in there.

OK. It's a little frustrating to break down a swing on video I can't look at frame by frame but I'll have a go. It's a very good swing. Looking at the first swing, if I had a front or back view maybe I could find something to whine about like maybe the lead arm is a little below the swing plane but I might not. It's just good. My worry if I was a college coach would be what does she look like on something at the knees. Not many kids have a swing this good. From the group this good on high pitches a minority are still impressive when you see them swing on a strike at the bottom of the zone. Surely the world class bp pitcher can give us something at the knees?

For me, swinging a bat is a geometry, biomechanics and physics question. This hitter reduces all that to an elegant very simple form. I'll ask my mentor what he sees since you asked. He's a harder grader than me. I see the positive because I know what I'd expect this kid to do in college and what her competition for college spots looks like on average. He sees only the inefficiencies as he compares a swing to the best in the world.

[jtat32]

I still don't know doctor. In 2012 I would tell her to let it get deeper. Please dissect.
http://youtu.be/6HkSRr4TOyc

Not sure if you are looking for any kind of genetic analysis, but from what I can gather from the clip I am fairly confident that she has an athletic mother.

ouch

All in good fun, of course.

A few serious points on the discussion:

- At the risk of coming across as a shill, Safebyahare, there is a web-based option for swing analysis - Steve Englishbey's site has this feature. It's subscription-based, but the cost is very reasonable (almost nominal). We've begun using it recently, and have found it to be very helpful. Steve approaches instruction in a different manner than just about anyone, and it takes some effort to get up to speed with him, but it is well worth the effort.

I'm certainly no hitting guru, but I'm going to go ahead and post an observation on the two swings. Both are certainly very good swings and both have a lot of elements that could used as a demonstration for what developing hitters should aspire to. I do see one key difference, though, that I'll point out for the sake of discussion:

The two girls load their lower body differently (for this observation, I'm using the middle clip of swings Jon's DD is taking while wearing a red shirt). Jon's DD is drawing her hips back in a linear direction, and then initiating her swing by driving them forward linearly. At a certain point, she launches a rotational swing and everything looks good from there, but the linear movement adds about four frames of time to her swing. Safebyahare's DD cocks her hips by slightly counter-rotating them. This is a much quicker movement, and as I understand things, a more effective loading of the lower body. A more exaggerated demonstration of this action can be seen in the clips of Michelle Smith at the link Mark posted in another recent thread:

http://imageevent.com/siggy/hitting/oly ... e2.camel_s

[jonriv]

Thanks for the feedback(although as a college senior not sure what changes will be made. ) I think the hip shift is a little exaggerated by the slo mo. Her swing has been pretty consistent through the years. In college they had her use a lighter bat and that "bunt" looking thing before the load. Both were to help her with timing and bat control to deal better with change-ups. She has always been able to handle the faster pitchers and has a good deal of power

[Mark H]

Talked to Steve last night and he pointed out some things he's going to comment on soon. Hopefully on here but if he puts it on his site I'll copy and paste it here with his permission. One of those things points out the problem of studying a swing when you can't look at it frame by frame. If you stop the clip at the right point, there is one frame where she extends the lead arm elbow and pushes the lead arm/hands down below the plane of shoulder rotation. She very quickly recovers and looks good by the time the bat is parallel with the lead arm forearm. More later.

[Mark H]

Thoughts on changing things late in the game.

Yeah, there is an argument that says if you are hitting as well as you want to at the highest level you aspire to, leave it alone. On the other hand, elite hitters I've talked to and read about are constantly working on the swing. Your call and I understand it can be scary. I don't see a swing here that needs to be rebuilt of course. I wouldn't be afraid of removing small inefficiencies while staying within the basic swing though.

If one of you knows how to convert this swing to a film strip of stills that would be great. You would think I'd have learned to do that by now.

[jonriv]

Thanks again. Tweaks are what I look for anyway at this point. She has always been an aggressive hitter which in the past made her vulnerable to a good change-up. Coaches have worked with her for years on becoming more patient at the plate and she has improved dramatically. The paradox has been that all of her college home runs have been first pitch hits. Trying to get her to study pitchers better to know who to be aggressive with an who to wait out. Try not to give her too much to think about, she has always been a "see the ball, hit the ball" kind of hitter and is usually best with a clear mind

She is only 5'5" but generates a lot of power