Top 25 Finalists for National Player of the Year

[Sam]

Sam, so you ruined your daughters arm playing part time........what would have happened if she played full time?

My DD actually ended up being a better hitter than pitcher, so she played 2B and OF when she wasn't pitching.

Every pitcher whose arm gets ruined does so as a part-time pitcher.

[SOFTBALL TAXI]

http://www.asasoftball.com/about/getStory.asp?nid=1817

Final 10 released May 6th, winner May 20th

Huge props to Ashley Hansen, Stanford, for being the only freshman. IMO, she won't win it, but has impressive #'s for a frosh- .427 BA & .641 SLG%

Name – School – Year – Position – Hometown

Chelsea Bramlett (Mississippi State) – Junior – Catcher/Infield – Cordova, Tenn.

Stacie Chambers (Arizona) – Junior – Catcher – Glendale, Az.

Ashley Charters (Washington) – Senior - Infield– Beaverton, Ore.

Kaitlin Cochran (Arizona State) - Senior- Outfield - Yorba Linda, Calif.

Kelsi Dunne (Alabama) – Sophomore – Pitcher – Port Orange, Fla.

Francesca Enea (Florida) – Junior – Outfield – Woodland Hills, Calif.

Amber Flores (Oklahoma) – Junior – Infield – Calexico, Calif.

Alisa Goler (Georgia) – Sophomore – Infield – Frankfort, Ill.

Alissa Haber (Stanford) – Junior – Outfield- Newark, Calif.

Ashley Hansen (Stanford) – Freshman – Infield – Chandler, Az.

Tiffany Huff (Tennessee) – Junior – Catcher/First Base – Saugus, Calif.

Cheyenne Jenks (Florida Gulf Coast) – Senior –Infield – Naples, Fla.

Brittany Lastrapes (Arizona) – Sophomore – Outfield - Laguna Niguel, Calif.

Danielle Lawrie (Washington) – Junior - Pitcher – Langley, British Columbia

Jenae Leles (Arizona) – Senior – Third Base – Fair Oaks, Calif.

Sam Marder (Ohio State) – Junior– Catcher - Calabasas, Calif.

Charlotte Morgan (Alabama) – Junior– Pitcher/Utility – Moreno Valley, Calif.

Stacey Nelson (Florida) – Senior – Pitcher – Los Alamitos, Calif.

Nikki Nemitz (Michigan) – Junior – Pitcher – St. Clair Shores, Mich.

Amber Patton (DePaul) – Senior – Third Base - Forsyth, Ill.

Missy Penna (Stanford) – Senior – Pitcher/Infield – Miami, Fla.

Brittany Rogers (Alabama) – Senior – Outfield - Dacula, Ga.

Kaila Shull (UCLA) – Junior – Catcher/Outfield – Lodi, Calif.

Danielle Spaulding (North Carolina) – Junior – First Base/Pitcher - Rancho Cucamonga, Calif.

Tammy Williams (Northwestern) – Senior – Infield - Roscoe, Mo.

Im going with the Bill Alen student
Charlotte Morgan

[anonlooker]

Danielle Spaulding (North Carolina) – Junior – First Base/Pitcher - Rancho Cucamonga, Calif.

http://tarheelblue.cstv.com/sports/w-so ... -body.html

http://tarheelblue.cstv.com/sports/w-so ... lle00.html

I agree with Sam except Danielle Spaulding should have been top ten, she plays when she does not pitch. A girl that pitches only should get pitcher of the year award not player of the year
Danielle is a great pitcher and a great player/hitter
#1 has spoken

Her little sister is pretty good too...

I liked her better last year

Nice!
Wit and repartee at it's finest!

[WhatElseIsThere]

Top 10 Finalists released today:

Stacie Chambers (Arizona) – Junior – Catcher – Glendale, Az.
Kaitlin Cochran (Arizona State) - Senior- Outfield - Yorba Linda, Calif.
Amber Flores (Oklahoma) – Junior – Infield – Calexico, Calif.
Alisa Goler (Georgia) – Sophomore – Infield – Frankfort, Ill.
Danielle Lawrie (Washington) – Junior - Pitcher – Langley, British Columbia
Charlotte Morgan (Alabama) – Junior– Pitcher/Utility – Moreno Valley, Calif.
Stacey Nelson (Florida) – Senior – Pitcher – Los Alamitos, Calif.
Amber Patton (DePaul) – Senior – Third Base - Forsyth, Ill.
Missy Penna (Stanford) – Senior – Pitcher/Infield – Miami, Fla.
Tammy Williams (Northwestern) – Senior – Infield - Roscoe, Mo.

Watching the last few weeks, I think it comes down to Cochran, Nelson, and Penna with the award going to Nelson.

No way they should give the award to Nelson or Lawrie...they are pitchers only...not players....its the National Player of the Year Award. You can at least make an argument for Morgan because she plays when she doesn't pitch. You can't give an award to a player who doesn't play in 30-40% of their teams' games.

It's Cochran's award...nobody else can hold a candle to her. She produced, in historical proportions, every year despite having nobody to protect her in the lineup. She has been the player of the year each and every year she has played. Not likely to see anyone with her talent for a while.

Sam,
Based on your logic that a pitcher is a part time player because she only plays 60% of the time, then it must also be true that a batter who comes up in the lineup one in nine times is a part time player because she contributes less than 10% of the time. So, a pitcher is only a pitcher, and a hitter is only a batter – they’re not players, and neither should be able to compete for the National Player of the Year award.

In reality, both are major contributors and one without the other is worthless.

My vote for National Player of the Year is Danielle Lawrie who racked up 325 Ks (>1.5 per inning) in 2009. Can you name a “full time” player indisputably responsible for 325 outs during the season?

[ssarge]

My vote for National Player of the Year is Danielle Lawrie who racked up 325 Ks (>1.5 per inning) in 2009. Can you name a “full time” player indisputably responsible for 325 outs during the season?

That logic will ALWAYS make the top K pitcher in the country the POY.

Which in fact, it generally does, which is why almost EVERYONE thinks there should be a pitcher of the year award AND a player of the year award.

That said, 10-11 Ks per 7 innmings is not impressive based on historical norms. Osterman, Abbott, and Tincher were all better than 14 Ks per 7 innings. Osterman was better than 14Ks per 7 innings for her CAREER.

This is an absolutely perfect year to finally prove that the POY means PLAYER of the year, not necessarily PITCHER of the year. Cochran or Chambers, as far as I am concerned, and I would personally vote for Cochran. Her modified OPS (see Moneyball; modified OPS is the single stat most used for comparison purposes in MLB) is over 1.900. Which is well above everyone else, and is frankly, absurd. Slug% over 1.000, to compliment a .440 average. In terms of all-around performance, this is her strongest year. All 4 years were strong - she will be in the top 5 CAREER in virtually every offensive statistical category. Top 5 in career average (although she is not a slapper), top 2 in career OB% and Slug %. Top 10 in Hrs. And THIS is her strongest year, despite the fact that absolutely no one pitches to her. Three errors in 4 years. Would steal 50 bases, if they let her run.

She was the first player drafted by NPF for a reason.

No slam on Lawrie. My daughter faced her this year, and I KNOW how good she is. A lot of other great players out there, too. But in my mind, and speaking purely statistically, Cochran's season is unmatched.

Best regards,

Scott

[Sam]

Top 10 Finalists released today:

Stacie Chambers (Arizona) – Junior – Catcher – Glendale, Az.
Kaitlin Cochran (Arizona State) - Senior- Outfield - Yorba Linda, Calif.
Amber Flores (Oklahoma) – Junior – Infield – Calexico, Calif.
Alisa Goler (Georgia) – Sophomore – Infield – Frankfort, Ill.
Danielle Lawrie (Washington) – Junior - Pitcher – Langley, British Columbia
Charlotte Morgan (Alabama) – Junior– Pitcher/Utility – Moreno Valley, Calif.
Stacey Nelson (Florida) – Senior – Pitcher – Los Alamitos, Calif.
Amber Patton (DePaul) – Senior – Third Base - Forsyth, Ill.
Missy Penna (Stanford) – Senior – Pitcher/Infield – Miami, Fla.
Tammy Williams (Northwestern) – Senior – Infield - Roscoe, Mo.

Watching the last few weeks, I think it comes down to Cochran, Nelson, and Penna with the award going to Nelson.

No way they should give the award to Nelson or Lawrie...they are pitchers only...not players....its the National Player of the Year Award. You can at least make an argument for Morgan because she plays when she doesn't pitch. You can't give an award to a player who doesn't play in 30-40% of their teams' games.

It's Cochran's award...nobody else can hold a candle to her. She produced, in historical proportions, every year despite having nobody to protect her in the lineup. She has been the player of the year each and every year she has played. Not likely to see anyone with her talent for a while.

Sam,
Based on your logic that a pitcher is a part time player because she only plays 60% of the time, then it must also be true that a batter who comes up in the lineup one in nine times is a part time player because she contributes less than 10% of the time. So, a pitcher is only a pitcher, and a hitter is only a batter – they’re not players, and neither should be able to compete for the National Player of the Year award.

In reality, both are major contributors and one without the other is worthless.

My vote for National Player of the Year is Danielle Lawrie who racked up 325 Ks (>1.5 per inning) in 2009. Can you name a “full time” player indisputably responsible for 325 outs during the season?

One could almost accept your argument for a DP since they only play half of every game, but there are 9 fielders who play the entire game. Pitchers don't play a single pitch of 30-40% of their teams' games. Lets look at these questions:

1) Would Peyton Manning win the MVP if he played 11 games for the Colts?
2) Would Lebron James win the MVP if he played 60 games?
3) Would Cliff Lee had won the Cy Young award if he started only 20 games?

The answer is No.

[Demonboy]

Nelson is is having a better year than Lawrie.

[3Bsnag]

Nelson is is having a better year than Lawrie.

I was thinking the same thing. Don't get me wrong, Lawrie is awesome too. But when you look at an ERA of .35, amt of IP, walks, etc, Nelson shines a little brighter.

Sam,
Let me turn it around a little. While I admit position players are slighted, would Florida be 53-3 without Nelson? Or 26-1 in the SEC? Would UF be setting record attendance or her teammates be nominated for all-this and all-that? Highly unlikely.

The award debate stems from that a pitcher controls her teams success as well as her personal stats. Either way this shakes out, both of these kids deserve it. Have there ever been co-recipients?

I'm guessing May 20th it will be down to Cochran, Nelson, and Chambers- position, pitcher, catcher.

[Sam]

Nelson is is having a better year than Lawrie.

I was thinking the same thing. Don't get me wrong, Lawrie is awesome too. But when you look at an ERA of .35, amt of IP, walks, etc, Nelson shines a little brighter.

Sam,
Let me turn it around a little. While I admit position players are slighted, would Florida be 53-3 without Nelson? Or 26-1 in the SEC? Would UF be setting record attendance or her teammates be nominated for all-this and all-that? Highly unlikely.

The award debate stems from that a pitcher controls her teams success as well as her personal stats. Either way this shakes out, both of these kids deserve it. Have there ever been co-recipients?

I'm guessing May 20th it will be down to Cochran, Nelson, and Chambers- position, pitcher, catcher.

Cochran helps her team to every one of their wins. Nelson's pitching teammate is 20-0...so Nelson has all three of their losses, including allowing 6 runs by Alabama while her team scored 4 runs...she has also lost to Washington and Lawrie....so its hard to even argue that she should be considered over Lawrie....and Nelson plays in a conference that just isn't that tough.

[WhatElseIsThere]

My vote for National Player of the Year is Danielle Lawrie who racked up 325 Ks (>1.5 per inning) in 2009. Can you name a “full time” player indisputably responsible for 325 outs during the season?

That logic will ALWAYS make the top K pitcher in the country the POY.

And??

Which in fact, it generally does, which is why almost EVERYONE thinks there should be a pitcher of the year award AND a player of the year award.

I too wish Softball had the equivalent of the Cy Young award, but it doesn’t . . . so great athletes like Cochran have to complete against great athletes like Lawrie.

That said, 10-11 Ks per 7 innmings is not impressive based on historical norms. Osterman, Abbott, and Tincher were all better than 14 Ks per 7 innings. Osterman was better than 14Ks per 7 innings for her CAREER.

A great ERA can be a function of outstanding defense and shouldn’t be attributed solely to the pitcher. But nobody can dispute who deserves the credit for a strikeout. Lawrie’s 2009 strikeout performance is better than her competition in this race. Okay, it’s not as good as Cat’s >14 Ks per game, but I wouldn’t consider that the “historical norm”.

This is an absolutely perfect year to finally prove that the POY means PLAYER of the year, not necessarily PITCHER of the year. Cochran or Chambers, as far as I am concerned, and I would personally vote for Cochran. Her modified OPS (see Moneyball; modified OPS is the single stat most used for comparison purposes in MLB) is over 1.900. Which is well above everyone else, and is frankly, absurd. Slug% over 1.000, to compliment a .440 average. In terms of all-around performance, this is her strongest year. All 4 years were strong - she will be in the top 5 CAREER in virtually every offensive statistical category. Top 5 in career average (although she is not a slapper), top 2 in career OB% and Slug %. Top 10 in Hrs. And THIS is her strongest year, despite the fact that absolutely no one pitches to her. Three errors in 4 years. Would steal 50 bases, if they let her run.

So the POY award really comes down to Lawrie’s pitching vs. Cochran’s hitting.

Pitchers do have an unfair advantage when competing for the POY award. When they’re in the game they’re involved in all the action, and a dominant pitcher stands out like no other player on the team. But to say they’re a part time player and should be disqualified because they’re a pitcher is unreasonable. This is Lawrie’s year, and she shouldn’t be penalized because this year we think someone other than a pitcher should be chosen.

She was the first player drafted by NPF for a reason.

No slam on Lawrie. My daughter faced her this year, and I KNOW how good she is. A lot of other great players out there, too. But in my mind, and speaking purely statistically, Cochran's season is unmatched.


Best regards,

Scott

You make a strong argument. Both Cochran and Lawrie had stellar years and the votes should reflect a tough decision, but my vote still belongs to Lawrie.