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Did you know about the Pro softball

What's on your mind?

by Schmick » Tue Mar 12, 2019 5:14 pm

Now take Jen Schro as an example. She has her facility in Anaheim/Yorba Linda that has about 7 or 8 hitting/pitching tunnels in it as well as a space for her catching lessons and space for fielding lessons, taught by Morgan Stuart.

Catching classes are an hour long and average between 15-25 students in each class, broken down by age levels. Each student is paying 50 dollars a class.
For 20 students a class, that's $1,000 an hour.
Morgan's fielding classes are a little smaller, roughly 10-20 students, I'm not sure what the cost of her class is but Ill assume it's at least 25 dollars an hour. So 15 students at 25 an hour and that's 375 an hour.
4 of the hitting tunnels are used for hitting lessons by the facility, I have seen them have as many as 8 girls going station to station at a time during lessons and was told the lessons were 50 dollars for 30 mins. So if there are 12 girls an hour going through that you're at 600 dollars an hour.
The other tunnels look like they are leased out to pitching coaches who also charge 40-50 dollars per 30 minute lesson. The facility may make 10 an hour off of each tunnel, say it's 3 tunnels and that's another 30 an hour.

Just in lessons the place is doing over 2k an hour. Say it's open 5 hours a day and 5 days a week, that's 100k a week, 400k a month. They also have a pro shop selling bats, gloves, helmets, cleats as well as all of their marketing apparel but I won't guess what that makes.

400k a month, say even 50k of that goes to renting the space, that's still around 350k a month. Jen and Morgan are 2 of the coaches there I recognized, Jen's dad does the hitting lessons as well, but let's be very conservative and say that Jen and Morgan are each making 35k a month from PSW, not including their Package Deal traveling clinic show
35k a month is likely more than what a semi-pro, minor softball league is going to pay any of its players


Now Jen and Co and PSW have done a remarkable job marketing themselves to get where they are at.

Let's take my DD's pitching coach who hasn't marketed to the same degree.
She has a smaller facility with 2 tunnels in it. She charges 45 dollars per 30 min lesson and is always booked, 2 lessons at a time. She gives lessons from 3pm til 10 pm Mon - Thur. 28 hours a week, 180 dollars per hour is just over 5k a week,/20k a month. She does have assistant coaches, all former students of hers who are currently playing in college or are freshly out of college. Say she pays them 30 dollars an hour that still leaves her with over 16,000 a month from lessons. Even if her lease was 5k a month she still has 11k a month in earnings for herself.

How many minor league baseball players are making 11k a month to play baseball? And they play games every day in front of 2-20 thousand paying fans. The WNBA doesnt play every day in front of 2-10k paying fans, with a smaller roster size.


So the question that needs to be asked about a pro softball league is, "what sort of compensation are the players looking to make?"
If the players want just $5k a month, figure 20 player roster size, that's 100k a month
You need at least 2 teams to have a game so that's 200k a month, just in player salaries.
Now, say they play 3 games a week for a total of 12 games a month
The games will need to make 17,000 dollars in ticket sales just to pay the 2 teams player's salaries. You would need 1700 people to each pay 10 dollars to watch the game.
That is JUST to pay the players salaries. That does not include the coaches and team administrators salaries. It does not include the stadium's grounds crews, ticket sellers, and custodians wages. It does not include the cost of the uniforms, equipment, team travel, accomodations and per diems for traveling players.

Their lies the problem with a pro softball league. If you can get 2000 people to show up 12 times a month and pay at least 20-25 dollars, including children, each to go in and watch, you still would likely not keep the league afloat.
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by jonriv » Tue Mar 12, 2019 5:44 pm

The key to any pro league is sponsors and tv contracts. Put out a great product in decent venues(in the right market) and crowds will come
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by Schmick » Tue Mar 12, 2019 6:50 pm

TV contracts and corporate sponsorships aren't realistic for a pro softball league, especially not initially.
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by jonriv » Tue Mar 12, 2019 7:06 pm

It is with big backer-like MLB

Usining it as away of increasing its main product(baseball’s) audience among women-btw the reason basketball backs the WNBA.

Also, the WNBA with all its failings still brings in $60mm in revenue an has larger per game attendance after 20 years than the NBA did after it first 20 years

A pro softball league does not need to be huge to successful- just big enough

Plus with all these new sports channels there is always a need for content
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by Schmick » Tue Mar 12, 2019 7:45 pm

NBA and wnba are the same game, only played by different genders.
The NBA didn't have to build new facilities for the wnba
The NBA didn't have to explain the rules to basketball viewers.

The cherry picked attendance stat is just that, cherry picked hyperbole. What years were the first 20 years for the NBA?
And I challenge any stat that the wnba makes 60 million in revenue, unless they're counting all revenues before paying out all liabilities.


MLB already has the female fans, at Dodger and Angels games I've been to I'd say at least 35% of the people in attendance are females. That's about the best you can hope for in sports because so many females don't like sports, at all.

MLB really doesn't have any thing to gain by subsidizing a different sport, that requires separate facilities and is trying to take place during the same time of year as MLB.
October to March pro softball season subsidized by MLB? One where MLB will need to build all new facilities and underwrite all of the salaries in hopes of maybe getting a few more girls to watch baseball games when not playing their own games?
You'd need to be a better salesman than I've ever seen to pedal that to the League
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by jonriv » Wed Mar 13, 2019 1:03 am

https://www.swishappeal.com/wnba/2018/7 ... ortunities

The Ct team of the WNBA play at the Mohegan Sun arena at the Mohegan Sun casino. They average close to 7k a night. CT has a pretty strong women’s basketball following due to the success of UCONN women’s basketball

NBA was started int 1946. Even into the late 60’s most games were not televised and even the championships were on tape delay. The NBA was not the game it is today until the Magic and Bird era

35% for a population that is 50% of the general population means there is certainly room for growth

As far as facilities- there are lots of beautiful college fields that are dormant during their off season. I am sure their are plenty of those that would love the income and publicity
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by eddiez577 » Wed Mar 13, 2019 10:56 am

jonriv wrote:https://www.swishappeal.com/wnba/2018/7/31/17633152/wnba-player-salaries-revenue-share-opportunities

The Ct team of the WNBA play at the Mohegan Sun arena at the Mohegan Sun casino. They average close to 7k a night. CT has a pretty strong women’s basketball following due to the success of UCONN women’s basketball

NBA was started int 1946. Even into the late 60’s most games were not televised and even the championships were on tape delay. The NBA was not the game it is today until the Magic and Bird era

35% for a population that is 50% of the general population means there is certainly room for growth

As far as facilities- there are lots of beautiful college fields that are dormant during their off season. I am sure their are plenty of those that would love the income and publicity


Dammit lets make it happen! This is how businesses start :)

As far as
Schmick wrote:Now take Jen Schro as an example. She has her facility in Anaheim/Yorba Linda that has about 7 or 8 hitting/pitching tunnels in it as well as a space for her catching lessons and space for fielding lessons, taught by Morgan Stuart.

Catching classes are an hour long and average between 15-25 students in each class, broken down by age levels. Each student is paying 50 dollars a class.
For 20 students a class, that's $1,000 an hour.
Morgan's fielding classes are a little smaller, roughly 10-20 students, I'm not sure what the cost of her class is but Ill assume it's at least 25 dollars an hour. So 15 students at 25 an hour and that's 375 an hour.
4 of the hitting tunnels are used for hitting lessons by the facility, I have seen them have as many as 8 girls going station to station at a time during lessons and was told the lessons were 50 dollars for 30 mins. So if there are 12 girls an hour going through that you're at 600 dollars an hour.
The other tunnels look like they are leased out to pitching coaches who also charge 40-50 dollars per 30 minute lesson. The facility may make 10 an hour off of each tunnel, say it's 3 tunnels and that's another 30 an hour.

Just in lessons the place is doing over 2k an hour. Say it's open 5 hours a day and 5 days a week, that's 100k a week, 400k a month. They also have a pro shop selling bats, gloves, helmets, cleats as well as all of their marketing apparel but I won't guess what that makes.

400k a month, say even 50k of that goes to renting the space, that's still around 350k a month. Jen and Morgan are 2 of the coaches there I recognized, Jen's dad does the hitting lessons as well, but let's be very conservative and say that Jen and Morgan are each making 35k a month from PSW, not including their Package Deal traveling clinic show
35k a month is likely more than what a semi-pro, minor softball league is going to pay any of its players


Now Jen and Co and PSW have done a remarkable job marketing themselves to get where they are at.

Let's take my DD's pitching coach who hasn't marketed to the same degree.
She has a smaller facility with 2 tunnels in it. She charges 45 dollars per 30 min lesson and is always booked, 2 lessons at a time. She gives lessons from 3pm til 10 pm Mon - Thur. 28 hours a week, 180 dollars per hour is just over 5k a week,/20k a month. She does have assistant coaches, all former students of hers who are currently playing in college or are freshly out of college. Say she pays them 30 dollars an hour that still leaves her with over 16,000 a month from lessons. Even if her lease was 5k a month she still has 11k a month in earnings for herself.

How many minor league baseball players are making 11k a month to play baseball? And they play games every day in front of 2-20 thousand paying fans. The WNBA doesnt play every day in front of 2-10k paying fans, with a smaller roster size.


So the question that needs to be asked about a pro softball league is, "what sort of compensation are the players looking to make?"
If the players want just $5k a month, figure 20 player roster size, that's 100k a month
You need at least 2 teams to have a game so that's 200k a month, just in player salaries.
Now, say they play 3 games a week for a total of 12 games a month
The games will need to make 17,000 dollars in ticket sales just to pay the 2 teams player's salaries. You would need 1700 people to each pay 10 dollars to watch the game.
That is JUST to pay the players salaries. That does not include the coaches and team administrators salaries. It does not include the stadium's grounds crews, ticket sellers, and custodians wages. It does not include the cost of the uniforms, equipment, team travel, accomodations and per diems for traveling players.

Their lies the problem with a pro softball league. If you can get 2000 people to show up 12 times a month and pay at least 20-25 dollars, including children, each to go in and watch, you still would likely not keep the league afloat.


goes back to a few posts ago, with the cost of a college education rising, sports scholarships not covering much, no guarantee of jobs or a promised career after college, is starting a business a smarter idea? Instead of a $100K student loan debt, would you invest $100K into a small business for your DD instead? IDK just a thought :|
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by Schmick » Wed Mar 13, 2019 2:12 pm

jonriv wrote:https://www.swishappeal.com/wnba/2018/7/31/17633152/wnba-player-salaries-revenue-share-opportunities

The Ct team of the WNBA play at the Mohegan Sun arena at the Mohegan Sun casino. They average close to 7k a night. CT has a pretty strong women’s basketball following due to the success of UCONN women’s basketball

NBA was started int 1946. Even into the late 60’s most games were not televised and even the championships were on tape delay. The NBA was not the game it is today until the Magic and Bird era

35% for a population that is 50% of the general population means there is certainly room for growth

As far as facilities- there are lots of beautiful college fields that are dormant during their off season. I am sure their are plenty of those that would love the income and publicity


And with all of the leg ups the wnba ×as given, it's still a failure that has to be bailed out financially by the NBA every year

Connecticut likes their girls basketball like
So Cal loves softball, that npf doesn't have a team in So Cal shows that pro softball isn't a viable sport right now.

50% of females won't watch sports, no matter who is playing. You're not going to get many more females out to mlb baseball games. If you did youd wind up with a bunch more of this
https://youtu.be/ngt1JK3DyOU
And nobody wants that. One will get hit with a ball and next thing you know the whole field will be covered in nets.
MLB sponsoring and subsidizing a pro woman's baseball league makes more sense than them trying to prop up a different sport.
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by giasdad » Fri Apr 05, 2019 1:36 pm

Schmick wrote:
We did ask the girls on my DDs team last year in Colorado if they would rather see a women's softball game or go see the Colorado Rockies play the gnats at Coors Field while we were up there. 100% of them chose Rockies vs gnats. What hope does pro softball have if even travel softball players would rather go watch baseball?



I agree with everything you say and it makes perfect sense, seriously. That being said, you seem to struggle spelling the word GIANTS. The team name you were looking for is a couple of your posts is GIANTS.

1988 was a long time ago!!
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