Umpire confuses fielding team by overestimating outs

[Lunatic Fringe]

Here is a beauty that happened to us today. The scoreboard incorretly stated we had 2 outs on the batting team. After a batter strikes out, our catcher asks the ump "How many outs are there?" and the ump incorrectly tells her "2" like the board says. She tells the infield that there are 2 outs. The next batter strikes out and our catcher rolls the ball back to the mound and she and the infield trot off the diamond to hit. Except there are only 2 outs for real and the runner on 3rd trots in to score. The ump knows he gave our catcher bad info but refuses to return the runner to 3rd and allows the run to count. What should have happened in this case (beyond the ump keeping track of the outs and the count for himself)?

[umpinva]

Here is a beauty that happened to us today. The scoreboard incorretly stated we had 2 outs on the batting team. After a batter strikes out, our catcher asks the ump "How many outs are there?" and the ump incorrectly tells her "2" like the board says. She tells the infield that there are 2 outs. The next batter strikes out and our catcher rolls the ball back to the mound and she and the infield trot off the diamond to hit. Except there are only 2 outs for real and the runner on 3rd trots in to score. The ump knows he gave our catcher bad info but refuses to return the runner to 3rd and allows the run to count. What should have happened in this case (beyond the ump keeping track of the outs and the count for himself)?

This is a correctable error. The umpire should have checked with his partner and taken a look at the home team's score book. On discovery that the were only two outs, the umpire places the runner back at third base and the defense goes back onto the field with two outs.

Why didn't the defensive coach, question this when F2 announced their were two outs?

[Lunatic Fringe]

My guess is that he was looking at the scoreboard too. The ump in the field walked by our dugout after the consultation shaking his head and shrugging his shoulders. He was sympathetic but apparently couldn't or wouldn't get the home plate ump to admit his mistake and amend his call (or non call). We did end up losing the game and exiting the tournament. All in all they are a very poor pair of umps who we have had the unfortunate pleasure of experiencing several times in the past. In fact, we have refused to play in Sugarland for the past 2 yrs where these clowns seem to practice the most. I wish they would just ump T-Ball.

[wadeintothem]

My guess is that he was looking at the scoreboard too. The ump in the field walked by our dugout after the consultation shaking his head and shrugging his shoulders. He was sympathetic but apparently couldn't or wouldn't get the home plate ump to admit his mistake and amend his call (or non call). We did end up losing the game and exiting the tournament. All in all they are a very poor pair of umps who we have had the unfortunate pleasure of experiencing several times in the past. In fact, we have refused to play in Sugarland for the past 2 yrs where these clowns seem to practice the most. I wish they would just ump T-Ball.

I'm not detracting from umpire blame here.. but if this is so well known about the umpires, I am also wondering why the coach asleep?

The number of outs are what they are by rule.. the umpire cannot adjust those. If there are 2 outs, there are 2 outs. An umpire cannot suddenly and arbitrarily rule there is 1 out or 3 outs.

If the outs are reported incorrectly, that needs to be addressed by the coach immediately.

They share the blame here..

but overall, I'm with umpinva, this is correctable and should be corrected. It is an easy fix and the umpires call clearly put the defense at a disadvantage. There is a chance that an umpire might not fix it, and leave it on the coaches.. as was done.

So I would strongly advise that your coaches wake up in the future. They have a job to do as well.

[Bretman]

Apparently, ten defensive players on the field lost track of how many outs there were, as well as all of their coaches, the players on the bench and even their scorekeeper who has the book right in front of him.

And let's not forget the guy running the scoreboard!

Seemingly, the offensive team did not. They must be better at math.

You would think that somebody would have piped-up before this became an issue. But they did not, and only one guy on the field gets the blame. The umpire.

Since he passed along bad information to the catcher, I would agree that this should be a correctable error. His error placed the defense at a disadvantage and gave the offense an unintended advantage. Put the runner back on third and resume with the proper number of outs.

Almost this same thing happened to me in a game last year. Only the defense just assumed on their own that the third out had been made- it wasn't because I had given them the wrong number of outs. They ran off the field when the second out was made, at their own peril, and the runner from third scored.

In that case, it was their own fault and too bad for them. The defensive coach seemed to think I should have killed the play, to protect them from their own mistake. Sorry, coach, it doesn't work that way. If I screw up, it's correctable. Screw up on your own, and the play stands.

[wadeintothem]

100% correct bret..

I'll add this for the sleepy headed coaches.

Some things are not correctable.. for example, if the umpire incorrectly gives the count as 1 strike, but there are 2 strikes... so the coach gives the "Take" signal in between his game time naps, the pitch is a strike.. but it is really strike 3 (not strike 2).. well there are no do-overs. You would eat something like that.

So these coaches must understand it is equally their job to be in the game.

Coaching is more than getting to wear a straw hat and cool tan shorts with long white socks.

You gotta be on top of it.