Making an attempt??

[pbj2000]

If my pitcher fake throws to 2nd can the 2nd baserunner come off the bag attempting to go to 3rd? Is that lookback? or is it not a lookback rule since my pitcher made an attempt (fake) throw?

thanks,

[Jalamander]

As soon as your pitcher makes an attempt to retire a runner (and a fake throw is considered an attempt), the lookback rule is no longer in effect.

[xxxYerOut]

If I am not mistaken, the pitcher doesn't even have to fake a throw. Hesitation (or look back) is waived off when the pitcher simply raises the ball into a defensive or throwing position.

[twinsmom]

In some places it is enough to face the runner and pull the ball out of your glove especially depending on the stance. One foot in front of the other and ball out of glove facing runner... I have seen umps consider that enough.

[HugoTafurst]

If I am not mistaken, the pitcher doesn't even have to fake a throw. Hesitation (or look back) is waived off when the pitcher simply raises the ball into a defensive or throwing position.

That depends on which rules you are playing under and umpire judgement.

[wadeintothem]

AsA 14U Had the play this weekend - 0 outs, R1@3B and the walk, I'm behind F6. Ball returned to pitcher in the circle, R1 takes lead, BR is doing her slow trot rounding 1B to 2b.. no problems.

Pitcher lifts arm (everyone yelling "get her", as happens), BR still slow trotting, - this maintains for an instant - pitcher then lowers her arm. So, I look at them all, BR, pitcher with hands down standing in circle, and the R1. ... R1 still hanging off bag.. I look at my partner and make eye contact to ensure no double call and look at the runner, shes still hanging off 3b, past id guess at least 2 Mississippi since the pitcher lowered her arms (rule is "immediate", but I understand the deliberate slowness in returning she probably should have been doing).. clearly no effort to even begin to return and I ring her.

The coach still right now will tell you that once the pitcher raised her arm, that took LBR off ("thats what I teach them") "its in the book"- and sure, making a play definitely takes off LBR.. any action causing the runner to react, and I certainly did consider her as making a play initially - but not forever. LBR can be instantly reinstated by that pitcher simply no longer making a play.. she lowers her arm, you better get back or advance.. immediately.

ASA is very strict on cat and mouse. Be very sure you had have a good understanding of the rule and understand that as quickly as LBR can be off, it can be back on again.

Understand there is a lot of umpire judgment involved.

[xxxYerOut]

Great explanation Wade. Thank you. And is why I would interpret it as a defensive position, not just taking the ball from the glove. Not sure I would consider one foot in front of the other a defensive position if the arms are at their side.

[HugoTafurst]

AsA 14U Had the play this weekend - 0 outs, R1@3B and the walk, I'm behind F6. Ball returned to pitcher in the circle, R1 takes lead, BR is doing her slow trot rounding 1B to 2b.. no problems.

Pitcher lifts arm (everyone yelling "get her", as happens), BR still slow trotting, - this maintains for an instant - pitcher then lowers her arm. So, I look at them all, BR, pitcher with hands down standing in circle, and the R1. ... R1 still hanging off bag.. I look at my partner and make eye contact to ensure no double call and look at the runner, shes still hanging off 3b, past id guess at least 2 Mississippi since the pitcher lowered her arms (rule is "immediate", but I understand the deliberate slowness in returning she probably should have been doing).. clearly no effort to even begin to return and I ring her.

The coach still right now will tell you that once the pitcher raised her arm, that took LBR off ("thats what I teach them") "its in the book"- and sure, making a play definitely takes off LBR.. any action causing the runner to react, and I certainly did consider her as making a play initially - but not forever. LBR can be instantly reinstated by that pitcher simply no longer making a play.. she lowers her arm, you better get back or advance.. immediately.

ASA is very strict on cat and mouse. Be very sure you had have a good understanding of the rule and understand that as quickly as LBR can be off, it can be back on again.

Understand there is a lot of umpire judgment involved.

That is the right call and the right explaination.
For the umpires reading this....
That [i]should be [i] the Plate umpire's call everytime.
One of the things that should be covered during a pre-game.
Teamwork...

[MTR]

Get rid of the damn rule and play the game.

[bruisedshins]

Sometimes you can't win!!! My DD was always taught to put her throwing hand and the ball into her glove and make no change in her stance that could be interpreted as "an attempt". That has worked for years. Then this season some moron in a blue shirt refused to call it because he interpreted her having her hand in her glove as a defensive move. That's why we don't play in Sugar Land, TX anymore!!