Question: How Do I Handle an Injured HP

[Sam]

Had a situation a couple of weeks ago. HP had been hit above the left eye by a foul ball from another field on Saturday and opened up a cut that likely needed stitches. Sunday he is wearing sunglasses and does a game for us on the bases...doing a pretty good job. The next game is the semifinal in the tourney and the umpire in question is now the HP. It becomes apparent after my pitcher throws the 1st inning that the only pitch he can see is down the middle....he is not calling pitches on the inside part of the plate...even when the entire ball is crossing the plate. His partner is telling my F4 that he doesn't know where the pitches are missing. I believe that the HP couldn't physically see out of his left eye after being hit the previous day and is likely flinching with his good eye due to the incident.

I knew that his partner, who was the HP the previous game, had already worked four games behind the plate that day.

If I point out the problem, I think I'm screwed:

a) HP refuses to recognize that there is a problem and takes it out on my team
b) HP agrees to switch with BU and he is bitter about working his 5th game behind the plate

The UIC was watching the game, but I really didn't know how to handle it.

Any suggestions?

P.S. I ended up getting tossed for arguing the strike zone instead....dumb move...but I didn't know what else to do....

[skahtboi]

Had a situation a couple of weeks ago. HP had been hit above the left eye by a foul ball from another field on Saturday and opened up a cut that likely needed stitches. Sunday he is wearing sunglasses and does a game for us on the bases...doing a pretty good job. The next game is the semifinal in the tourney and the umpire in question is now the HP. It becomes apparent after my pitcher throws the 1st inning that the only pitch he can see is down the middle....he is not calling pitches on the inside part of the plate...even when the entire ball is crossing the plate. His partner is telling my F4 that he doesn't know where the pitches are missing. I believe that the HP couldn't physically see out of his left eye after being hit the previous day and is likely flinching with his good eye due to the incident.

I knew that his partner, who was the HP the previous game, had already worked four games behind the plate that day.

If I point out the problem, I think I'm screwed:

a) HP refuses to recognize that there is a problem and takes it out on my team
b) HP agrees to switch with BU and he is bitter about working his 5th game behind the plate

The UIC was watching the game, but I really didn't know how to handle it.

Any suggestions?

P.S. I ended up getting tossed for arguing the strike zone instead....dumb move...but I didn't know what else to do....

First of all, use the proper nomenclature so that all will understand your posts clearly. He is a plate umpire (PU) and not a home plate (HP). Secondly, there is a rule that prohibits coaches and competitors from arguing about the strike zone and other judgement calls. Ignoring that rule should not be anymore of an option than ignoring any other rule.

Did it occur to you that IF he was missing the inside corner, then he was doing so for both teams? Why do you feel the need to do anything? Just play ball and work with his zone. Why is there this need among adults who are playing a game, a game, to feel the need to try to control elements outside of their control? Remember, it is a game. For fun. To relax after a tough week at work. Unless you are one of those guys who are living out their major league fantasies through playing a game any child can play, I would say do absolutely nothing rather than play.


You also state the UIC was standing right there. If he felt there was a problem, I am sure that he would have addressed it.

Also, let me give you a little insight on umpires. Most, (not all of course), would never "take out" anything on a team, even if that team consisted of total jackasses. That is something that AA's tend to use as a rationalization as to why they lost the game 25-3. It had to, in some way, be the umpires' fault.

[mgkblue]

Normally I would agree with skahtboi.

I saw the gush on the eyebrow and have no doubt that this umpire was making his call with a swollen eye and a fear of being hit in the mask that would further open the gap.

Your unfortunate situation, IMO, arose because of a weak UIC. I have UICed a number of tournaments and I would never have allowed the unpire in his condition to umpire. Not on the bases and absolutely not behind the plate.

[Sam]

Had a situation a couple of weeks ago. HP had been hit above the left eye by a foul ball from another field on Saturday and opened up a cut that likely needed stitches. Sunday he is wearing sunglasses and does a game for us on the bases...doing a pretty good job. The next game is the semifinal in the tourney and the umpire in question is now the HP. It becomes apparent after my pitcher throws the 1st inning that the only pitch he can see is down the middle....he is not calling pitches on the inside part of the plate...even when the entire ball is crossing the plate. His partner is telling my F4 that he doesn't know where the pitches are missing. I believe that the HP couldn't physically see out of his left eye after being hit the previous day and is likely flinching with his good eye due to the incident.

I knew that his partner, who was the HP the previous game, had already worked four games behind the plate that day.

If I point out the problem, I think I'm screwed:

a) HP refuses to recognize that there is a problem and takes it out on my team
b) HP agrees to switch with BU and he is bitter about working his 5th game behind the plate

The UIC was watching the game, but I really didn't know how to handle it.

Any suggestions?

P.S. I ended up getting tossed for arguing the strike zone instead....dumb move...but I didn't know what else to do....

First of all, use the proper nomenclature so that all will understand your posts clearly. He is a plate umpire (PU) and not a home plate (HP). Secondly, there is a rule that prohibits coaches and competitors from arguing about the strike zone and other judgement calls. Ignoring that rule should not be anymore of an option than ignoring any other rule.

Did it occur to you that IF he was missing the inside corner, then he was doing so for both teams? Why do you feel the need to do anything? Just play ball and work with his zone. Why is there this need among adults who are playing a game, a game, to feel the need to try to control elements outside of their control? Remember, it is a game. For fun. To relax after a tough week at work. Unless you are one of those guys who are living out their major league fantasies through playing a game any child can play, I would say do absolutely nothing rather than play.


You also state the UIC was standing right there. If he felt there was a problem, I am sure that he would have addressed it.

Also, let me give you a little insight on umpires. Most, (not all of course), would never "take out" anything on a team, even if that team consisted of total jackasses. That is something that AA's tend to use as a rationalization as to why they lost the game 25-3. It had to, in some way, be the umpires' fault.

A) I'm not a rookie, so don't play the "you can't argue the strike zone" card. I've coached travel in SoCal for 9 years and other levels of ball for another 20.
B) I dealt with the zone all the way through ITB without saying a word to the guy.
C) Forcing Gold pitchers to throw the ball down the middle is DANGEROUS. The pitcher is less than 38' from the batter after release. Gold pitchers survive by hitting corners and moving the ball. My pitcher has verballed to Univ of Illinois...full ride...she knows if he is missing pitches...my catcher knows if he is missing pitches .....and the BU certainly knows if he is missing pitches.
D) The opposing pitcher was throwing about 50mph and didn't throw inside.
E) I would agree that not many umpires would consciously inflict retribution on a team....but subconciously, they might.
F) I asked for suggestions regarding resolvement of the issue. You basically call me a liar and tell me to deal with it....which makes you look like the south end of a northbound horse. Thanks for the input though.

[Skarp]

HammerDrivingNail.jpg (24.66 KiB) Viewed 4911 times

[wadeintothem]

This is not sams first day so I think for sake of convo he can be given the benefit of the doubt.... and he got tossed so whats the prob? Good coaches of high level teams know. I dont know about your area shahtbi, but here, you cant just BS every coach.. the ones up here do know.

He knows he cant argue the strike zone and fully expected to get tossed.

Just because you cant argue strikes and balls does not correlate to "all strike zones are good". When I'm working with someone who has a messed up zone I let them know (after the game).

You cant squeeze em all the around, you gotta at least give the pitcher somewhere to work. It may be their job to find that, but the pitcher gets something. And if the ump isnt doing that, he isnt doing his job. You cant force a pitcher to throw meatballs down the center. If you do, be ready to toss a lot of coaches and essentially do a poor job as an umpire.

This isnt slow pitch.

And I think thats all Sam was asking for.. something besides red. There must be a yellow and a green.

[skahtboi]

This is not sams first day so I think for sake of convo he can be given the benefit of the doubt.... and he got tossed so whats the prob? Good coaches of high level teams know. I dont know about your area shahtbi, but here, you cant just BS every coach.. the ones up here do know.

He knows he cant argue the strike zone and fully expected to get tossed.

Just because you cant argue strikes and balls does not correlate to "all strike zones are good". When I'm working with someone who has a messed up zone I let them know (after the game).

You cant squeeze em all the around, you gotta at least give the pitcher somewhere to work. It may be their job to find that, but the pitcher gets something. And if the ump isnt doing that, he isnt doing his job. You cant force a pitcher to throw meatballs down the center. If you do, be ready to toss a lot of coaches and essentially do a poor job as an umpire.

This isnt slow pitch.

And I think thats all Sam was asking for.. something besides red. There must be a yellow and a green.

The fact is, from the way the post read, I was thinking that it was SP. For that assumption, I stand corrected. Usually, facial lacerations from a foul ball occur in SP. The mask usually, note the usage of the word "usually," protects the face from such injuries in MP and FP.

Wade, I don't know about your area, but here it is rare for an umpire to talk to coaches about their observations of their partner's performance. I would never dream of telling a coach or a player, when I am the BU, something along the lines of "I don't know what is wrong with that pitch." That is not at all professional, and only adds to the problems of an already (apparently) problematic situation.

As to the squeezing the strike zone, I agree with you that umpire is not doing his job. Yet, we see this all of the time. It happens. Umpires with two good eyes squeeze the zone daily. This is where a player or a coach needs to work with the tools they are given. Would I want it to be otherwise? Sure. But we are dealing with the realities of being human.

High level coaches are pretty much the same every where I have travelled. The same here as in your area.

[skahtboi]

Had a situation a couple of weeks ago. HP had been hit above the left eye by a foul ball from another field on Saturday and opened up a cut that likely needed stitches. Sunday he is wearing sunglasses and does a game for us on the bases...doing a pretty good job. The next game is the semifinal in the tourney and the umpire in question is now the HP. It becomes apparent after my pitcher throws the 1st inning that the only pitch he can see is down the middle....he is not calling pitches on the inside part of the plate...even when the entire ball is crossing the plate. His partner is telling my F4 that he doesn't know where the pitches are missing. I believe that the HP couldn't physically see out of his left eye after being hit the previous day and is likely flinching with his good eye due to the incident.

I knew that his partner, who was the HP the previous game, had already worked four games behind the plate that day.

If I point out the problem, I think I'm screwed:

a) HP refuses to recognize that there is a problem and takes it out on my team
b) HP agrees to switch with BU and he is bitter about working his 5th game behind the plate

The UIC was watching the game, but I really didn't know how to handle it.

Any suggestions?

P.S. I ended up getting tossed for arguing the strike zone instead....dumb move...but I didn't know what else to do....

First of all, use the proper nomenclature so that all will understand your posts clearly. He is a plate umpire (PU) and not a home plate (HP). Secondly, there is a rule that prohibits coaches and competitors from arguing about the strike zone and other judgement calls. Ignoring that rule should not be anymore of an option than ignoring any other rule.

Did it occur to you that IF he was missing the inside corner, then he was doing so for both teams? Why do you feel the need to do anything? Just play ball and work with his zone. Why is there this need among adults who are playing a game, a game, to feel the need to try to control elements outside of their control? Remember, it is a game. For fun. To relax after a tough week at work. Unless you are one of those guys who are living out their major league fantasies through playing a game any child can play, I would say do absolutely nothing rather than play.


You also state the UIC was standing right there. If he felt there was a problem, I am sure that he would have addressed it.

Also, let me give you a little insight on umpires. Most, (not all of course), would never "take out" anything on a team, even if that team consisted of total jackasses. That is something that AA's tend to use as a rationalization as to why they lost the game 25-3. It had to, in some way, be the umpires' fault.

A) I'm not a rookie, so don't play the "you can't argue the strike zone" card. I've coached travel in SoCal for 9 years and other levels of ball for another 20.
B) I dealt with the zone all the way through ITB without saying a word to the guy.
C) Forcing Gold pitchers to throw the ball down the middle is DANGEROUS. The pitcher is less than 38' from the batter after release. Gold pitchers survive by hitting corners and moving the ball. My pitcher has verballed to Univ of Illinois...full ride...she knows if he is missing pitches...my catcher knows if he is missing pitches .....and the BU certainly knows if he is missing pitches.
D) The opposing pitcher was throwing about 50mph and didn't throw inside.
E) I would agree that not many umpires would consciously inflict retribution on a team....but subconciously, they might.
F) I asked for suggestions regarding resolvement of the issue. You basically call me a liar and tell me to deal with it....which makes you look like the south end of a northbound horse. Thanks for the input though.

As you omitted the level or type of ball you were talking about, you left it for the readers to make an assumption. Where does that place you on that northbound horse?

Trust me, if I had wanted to you a liar, I would have done just that. I wouldn't have veiled it behind some prose. I am a very straightforward guy. I am not here to argue with you. I read lots of umpiring sites every day. You sounded, in your OP, like so many other complaining SP coaches.

Now, to your "resolvement" of the issue. What do you expect to be able to do? How do you expect to be able to handle anything involving the umpires assigned to work your game? There is really little or nothing a coach can do in this type of case. (I have been on both sides of the umpire/coach debate.) You could have mentioned that you didn't feel that he was seeing pitches clearly, but that wouldn't have done anything but allow you to vent. Most associations prevent the switching of umpires for anything but illness or injury. You can't request a change. It won't happen. What you need to do, and what I have told my players many times when faced with "challenging" situations, is to work the best with what you have. That's about it.

Also, what did you gain from questioning the strike zone and getting tossed? I have found that getting tossed from a game is rarely a motivating tool. But that is just me.

As to this particular PU's partner talking about about the strike zone. Shame on him. Not only did he throw his partner under the bus, but he only added to the problems of an already problematic game.

Sorry if I failed to understand your OP, but you have to admit, some of the blame lies in the absence of information.

[skahtboi]

...but I didn't know what else to do....

Perhaps the best advice for this type of situation comes from St. Francis of Assisi:

"Lord grant me the serenity to accept the things I cannot change,
the courage to change the things I can, and
the wisdom to know the difference."

[Skarp]

As you omitted the level or type of ball you were talking about, you left it for the readers to make an assumption. Where does that place you on that northbound horse?

Trust me, if I had wanted to you a liar, I would have done just that. I wouldn't have veiled it behind some prose. I am a very straightforward guy. I am not here to argue with you. I read lots of umpiring sites every day. You sounded, in your OP, like so many other complaining SP coaches.

Now, to your "resolvement" of the issue. What do you expect to be able to do? How do you expect to be able to handle anything involving the umpires assigned to work your game? There is really little or nothing a coach can do in this type of case. (I have been on both sides of the umpire/coach debate.) You could have mentioned that you didn't feel that he was seeing pitches clearly, but that wouldn't have done anything but allow you to vent. Most associations prevent the switching of umpires for anything but illness or injury. You can't request a change. It won't happen. What you need to do, and what I have told my players many times when faced with "challenging" situations, is to work the best with what you have. That's about it.

Also, what did you gain from questioning the strike zone and getting tossed? I have found that getting tossed from a game is rarely a motivating tool. But that is just me.

As to this particular PU's partner talking about about the strike zone. Shame on him. Not only did he throw his partner under the bus, but he only added to the problems of an already problematic game.

Sorry if I failed to understand your OP, but you have to admit, some of the blame lies in the absence of information.

Skahtboi,

Sam has nearly 400 posts on this site (and probably 4000 more on its predecessor), and he isn't exactly bashful about putting his information out there. To suggest that he is somehow faultworthy for "absense of information," as if he is supposed to provide his entire resume for newbie convenience as a preface to each and every post he makes, is absurd.

RTFF! (Then talk all the smack you want.)