Crashing the plate

[topper]

This one is very simple. A runner cannot intentionally crash into a player, even if the player does not have the ball and is blocking the plate. This is not major league baseball. We have an out with player being ejected and no run scored.

The player must slide or avoid by going around the catcher, we then have dead ball, obs and award the player home.

I would have both. Run scores on the OBS. Runner ejected for the intentional crash. Please cite in whatever rules set TC uses where an out is called for.

[Makina]

My understanding is that when u have an intentional crash/unsportsmanlike conduct, it overrules any prior obs.

[tcannizzo]

U r correct there is no rule that says she must slide. But in order for me not to rule that she intentionally crashed and knocked down catcher I would recommend that the player do the following:

1. She must stop if standing then go around (avoiding the crash)
2. Slide into catcher
3. Jump over the catcher
4. Just avoid by running around catcher and then going back to the plate

If she does anything that shows me that she is not trying to knock down the catcher, then I have obstruction and award her home plate.

In RS 13 page 117 it states that a runner MAY slide, jump, go around to avoid crashing into the defender.

"If the act is determined to be flagrant, the offender is ejected."

If u where to argue that the catcher did not have the ball then I would still eject the player for unsportsman like conduct for malicious contact with the catcher.

I hope this clarifies things for you.

Crashing is intentional contact in its most extreme form, and by definition is USC justifying ejection.

But we have all seen significant unintentional contact between runner and defender, that is not considered crashing. Even where potentially both players are on the ground and possibly even with injuries.

Example: R tries to avoid contact with F2, but does not fully miss. They get tangled and mangled. Clearly not intentional and therefore not Crashing or USC. F2 is subject to OBS if not in possession/control of the ball at time of contact.

[Makina]

I was replying to the original poster that said the runner lowered her shoulder knocked the catcher down. Of course if I felt it was just a wreck, then I call OBS.

[MTR]

My understanding is that when u have an intentional crash/unsportsmanlike conduct, it overrules any prior obs.

Speaking ASA

Only if it is interference.

[AlwaysImprove]

That was going to be my question. Situation is catcher is clearly blocking most of the plate, maybe a little on the back side showing. Catcher does not have ball. Runner comes barreling, shoulder lowered and intentionally brings the hammer to the catcher. Then lands on the home plate. Runner could have slid to the backside of home plate.

What would be the call?

[MTR]

That was going to be my question. Situation is catcher is clearly blocking most of the plate, maybe a little on the back side showing. Catcher does not have ball. Runner comes barreling, shoulder lowered and intentionally brings the hammer to the catcher. Then lands on the home plate. Runner could have slid to the backside of home plate.

What would be the call?

Unsportsmanlike conduct, the runner is ejected at the end of the play.

There was an old interpretation by the ASA NUS that would also rule the runner out, but that passed on with the staff of the past. There was an attempted rule change a few years back to provide a rule to back up the interpretation and it was NOT supported by the umpire's committee and summarily dismissed as a consideration.

[AlwaysImprove]

Thanks. That helps a ton. Nice to get the ASA NUS background on it.

Either call is going to bring blue some heat. If I were the blue and this came up, I would feel better about calling unsportsmanlike conduct, runner out and not scoring the run.

Just to make sure I understand what you are saying. Old interpretation was unsportsmanlike conduct, runner out, no run scored. There was an attempted rule change to support calling this unsportsmanlike conduct, runner out, no run scored, but that was dismissed.

So that leaves us currently with unsportsmanlike conduct, run scores, player ejected after end of play as the current ruling?

[Lunatic Fringe]

I would much rather see my daughter ejected than to tear up her knee trying to dance around the catcher while running top speed to trying to score.

In the past she has stopped short of HP and gets tagged out and told afterwords that had she initiated contact, she would have been awarded the plate on an obstruction call.

It seems to me that 4 out of 5 times, the catcher was coached to block the plate prior to catching the ball. I don't have any sympathy for a catcher who falls asleep in the baseline while a runner is attempting to score. None

[MTR]

I would much rather see my daughter ejected than to tear up her knee trying to dance around the catcher while running top speed to trying to score.

As opposed to a broken arm, leg, wrist, hand, neck, back, etc. that can happen in any collision between two human beings.

In the past she has stopped short of HP and gets tagged out and told afterwords that had she initiated contact, she would have been awarded the plate on an obstruction call.

Protest the game. That is a dead wrong interpretation in any softball game.

It seems to me that 4 out of 5 times, the catcher was coached to block the plate prior to catching the ball. I don't have any sympathy for a catcher who falls asleep in the baseline while a runner is attempting to score. None

I don't have any sympathy for anyone who doesn't play or officiate the game properly.