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by Skarp » Tue Dec 13, 2016 5:59 pm

PDad wrote:Hey Skarp, how about showing us when you and/or Trump started speaking out against Muslims coming to the US. I expect it to be 10-25 years ago given the criticism you're laying on others for back then.

Anyone who continued to support the systematic importation of Muslims into this country beyond, at a minimum, September 11, 2001, is an absolute moron. That's 15 years right out of the gate.

Personally, I was raised in a very liberal environment, and I probably retained some vestiges of those views--which may or may not have included an inclusive mindset toward Muslim immigration--until I was 25 or so. Beyond then it would have been "hell no" to the lot of them. I'm 50 now, so there's your 25 years.

One point of distinction that you seem to be missing is that neither I nor Trump were responsible for safeguarding our country or its citizens at any time during the past 25 years. Kasich was. So whether I carried a torch about the issue for years or just woke up to it recently is entirely irrelevant; Kasich was a piss-poor public servant either way.
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by PDad » Tue Dec 13, 2016 6:40 pm

Skarp wrote:
PDad wrote:Hey Skarp, how about showing us when you and/or Trump started speaking out against Muslims coming to the US. I expect it to be 10-25 years ago given the criticism you're laying on others for back then.

Anyone who continued to support the systematic importation of Muslims into this country beyond, at a minimum, September 11, 2001, is an absolute moron. That's 15 years right out of the gate.

Personally, I was raised in a very liberal environment, and I probably retained some vestiges of those views--which may or may not have included an inclusive mindset toward Muslim immigration--until I was 25 or so. Beyond then it would have been "hell no" to the lot of them. I'm 50 now, so there's your 25 years.

One point of distinction that you seem to be missing is that neither I nor Trump were responsible for safeguarding our country or its citizens at any time during the past 25 years. Kasich was. So whether I carried a torch about the issue for years or just woke up to it recently is entirely irrelevant; Kasich was a piss-poor public servant either way.

The point you're conveniently avoiding is governors and mayors can't do anything about it, so you shouldn't be criticizing them for not speaking out against it unless you were. Trump publicly expressed lots of opinions back then and campaigned on them, so there's no excuse for him if it was as obvious as you say.
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by PDad » Tue Dec 13, 2016 7:05 pm

Skarp wrote:
PDad wrote:
But, prior to September 2015, it was not nearly enough by the count of one John R. Kasich. Perhaps it's just that you agree(d) with him?

FTFY The rest is typical Trumpie rhetoric - heavy on the insults and light on accuracy. Bottom line is Kasich and his predecessors couldn't do anything about it.

I did fumble and bumble across this, however: http://www.nytimes.com/politics/first-draft/2015/11/17/john-kasich-shifts-his-stand-on-accepting-refugees/

I still take this one over your NYT - http://www.ohio.com/news/local/ohio-gov-kasich-writes-to-stop-resettlement-in-wake-of-paris-attacks-1.641112

In early September, Kasich agreed with the president’s plan, provided adequate security concerns were addressed. A couple of weeks later, after the national security director said there were no guarantees that all terrorists could be filtered out, Kasich changed his support to opposition.

While looking that up again, I ran across this gem - http://www.breitbart.com/video/2015/09/05/trump-us-should-help-as-much-as-possible-with-refugee-crisis-possibly-let-some-in/

Republican presidential candidate Donald Trump stated that while “There’s only so much we can do. We have to fix our own country” the US should “help as much as possible” with the European refugee crisis and “possibly” let some refugees into the US on Friday’s broadcast of MSNBC’s “Morning Joe.”

Hmm, not the tough stance you characterized him having...

I took the liberty of fixing that back for you.

FTFY, again,
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by Skarp » Thu Dec 15, 2016 10:31 am

PDad wrote:
Skarp wrote:
PDad wrote:Hey Skarp, how about showing us when you and/or Trump started speaking out against Muslims coming to the US. I expect it to be 10-25 years ago given the criticism you're laying on others for back then.

Anyone who continued to support the systematic importation of Muslims into this country beyond, at a minimum, September 11, 2001, is an absolute moron. That's 15 years right out of the gate.

Personally, I was raised in a very liberal environment, and I probably retained some vestiges of those views--which may or may not have included an inclusive mindset toward Muslim immigration--until I was 25 or so. Beyond then it would have been "hell no" to the lot of them. I'm 50 now, so there's your 25 years.

One point of distinction that you seem to be missing is that neither I nor Trump were responsible for safeguarding our country or its citizens at any time during the past 25 years. Kasich was. So whether I carried a torch about the issue for years or just woke up to it recently is entirely irrelevant; Kasich was a piss-poor public servant either way.

The point you're conveniently avoiding is governors and mayors can't do anything about it, so you shouldn't be criticizing them for not speaking out against it unless you were. Trump publicly expressed lots of opinions back then and campaigned on them, so there's no excuse for him if it was as obvious as you say.

Well you have quite convinced me. Kasich is awesome!! Too bad nobody noticed.
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by PDad » Thu Dec 15, 2016 3:13 pm

Skarp wrote:Well you have quite convinced me. Kasich is awesome!! Too bad nobody noticed.

Never said he's awesome, just objected to some unfair blame being heaped on him.

Trumpies tend to operate in bipolar extremes (e.g. greatest and worst) and reality is somewhere in between.
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by Skarp » Thu Dec 15, 2016 11:45 pm

PDad wrote:
Skarp wrote:Well you have quite convinced me. Kasich is awesome!! Too bad nobody noticed.

Never said he's awesome, just objected to some unfair blame being heaped on him.

Trumpies tend to operate in bipolar extremes (e.g. greatest and worst) and reality is somewhere in between.

Right. You're a veritable paragon of impartiality. :roll:

Me? I'm a shameless partisan in service of my own values and considered opinions. As is every person with half a brain. You want to defend Kasich's record on the Muslim/refugee issue? Fine. That dunce cap fits you nicely.
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by PDad » Fri Dec 16, 2016 9:12 am

Skarp wrote:
PDad wrote:
Skarp wrote:Well you have quite convinced me. Kasich is awesome!! Too bad nobody noticed.

Never said he's awesome, just objected to some unfair blame being heaped on him.

Trumpies tend to operate in bipolar extremes (e.g. greatest and worst) and reality is somewhere in between.

Right. You're a veritable paragon of impartiality. :roll:

Me? I'm a shameless partisan in service of my own values and considered opinions. As is every person with half a brain. You want to defend Kasich's record on the Muslim/refugee issue? Fine. That dunce cap fits you nicely.

Everyone is entitled to their opinions and to express them. However, anyone with half a brain recognizes when Trumpies latch onto any flimsy excuse to attack people simply because they're still butthurt about those people not kissing Trump's butt during the campaign. Those Trumpies should instead grow up and follow Trump's lead of focusing on the future instead of the past. #MAGA
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by Skarp » Fri Dec 16, 2016 12:03 pm

PDad wrote:
Skarp wrote:
PDad wrote:
Skarp wrote:Well you have quite convinced me. Kasich is awesome!! Too bad nobody noticed.

Never said he's awesome, just objected to some unfair blame being heaped on him.

Trumpies tend to operate in bipolar extremes (e.g. greatest and worst) and reality is somewhere in between.

Right. You're a veritable paragon of impartiality. :roll:

Me? I'm a shameless partisan in service of my own values and considered opinions. As is every person with half a brain. You want to defend Kasich's record on the Muslim/refugee issue? Fine. That dunce cap fits you nicely.

Everyone is entitled to their opinions and to express them. However, anyone with half a brain recognizes when Trumpies latch onto any flimsy excuse to attack people simply because they're still butthurt about those people not kissing Trump's butt during the campaign. Those Trumpies should instead grow up and follow Trump's lead of focusing on the future instead of the past. #MAGA

Butt-hurt? What on earth are you talking about? We "Trumpies" won. And guess what? We didn't want the support of establishment hacks. We actually wanted them to oppose Trump's policies--just exactly like they did. We wanted them to show their little panties once and for all, and they obliged in spades.

This isn't a discussion about the presidential election. It is a discussion about a real-life tragedy which resulted from real-world policies strongly supported by certain real-world politicians, one of whom happens to be the sitting governor of Ohio and a graduate of Ohio State University.
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by Sam » Fri Dec 16, 2016 12:24 pm

Kasich used to be a good guy, when he was in the HoR under Gingrich...as were Lindsay Graham and Jeff Flake.....all of whom were either corrupted by the system or are now showing their true colors. RINOs
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by PDad » Fri Dec 16, 2016 12:51 pm

Skarp wrote:
PDad wrote:Everyone is entitled to their opinions and to express them. However, anyone with half a brain recognizes when Trumpies latch onto any flimsy excuse to attack people simply because they're still butthurt about those people not kissing Trump's butt during the campaign. Those Trumpies should instead grow up and follow Trump's lead of focusing on the future instead of the past. #MAGA

Butt-hurt? What on earth are you talking about? We "Trumpies" won. (understood) And guess what? We didn't want the support of establishment hacks. We actually wanted them to oppose Trump's policies--just exactly like they did. We wanted them to show their little panties once and for all, and they obliged in spades. (true in primaries, but Trump wanted their support in general)

This isn't a discussion about the presidential election. It is a discussion about a real-life tragedy which resulted from real-world policies strongly supported by certain real-world politicians, one of whom happens to be the sitting governor of Ohio and a graduate of Ohio State University.

We've already covered this ground. smh Pardon me for not wanting to continue your endless loop of ignoring reality and blaming the wrong people for the policy that led to this tragedy.
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