FACE MASK

[Dunder_Mifflin]

I would guess there is not a loud cry in baseball because the F1 F3 and F5 don't play so close to the hitter and the fake bunt/swing away is not as popuar. Also, in regards to your point about baseball, MLB does not allow aluminum/composite bats due to the dangers posed to the pitcher, and remember baseball pitchers have been killed from line drives to the head from aluminum/composite bats. Don't forget, last year a base coach in the baseball minor leagues (90 feet away) was killed by a line drive off a wooden bat. Will masks ever be mandatory, probably not. Are they a good idea, Hell Yes!

We are finally getting somewhere with this argument. We could pine away all day and night about the stats and distances and types of bats used. We can try to justify or not why baseball and softball are different, but really they aren't. The same dangers of the games are there no matter what age or level of play.

The SEC conference (Softball) requires all Base Coaches to wear a batters helmet to protect against foul balls. This is due to an unfortunate accident that happened in a minor league baseball game. So, how many of you coaches wear a batters helmet? Isn't a bit of a double standard to make your girls wear a mask when you yourself don't set the safety equipment example?

If bats are the problem, then why not the balls? Why not soften the core?
If the fake bunt/swing away is the problem, then why not remove it from the game?
If reaction time is the problem for a pitcher, the why not move the pitching rubber to 46 feet?

Just because a kid wears a mask does not mean they will avoid the dangers of the game.
They will be there no matter what.

I appreciate a civil response, for once.
Safety in the game is important, but it isn't as simple as wearing shin pads or a mask.

You are correct, it is not as simple as wearing shin pads or a mask, and when you have kids swinging a bat as hard as they can, along with girls running as fast as they can and throwing a ball as fast as they can you will never be able to protect them from all the inherent dangers that come with playing the sport. I think the only thing most people are trying to say is a mask takes a bit of the danger, no matter how small, out of the game.

I know I'm not, and I don't think any one else is, saying that our girls need to wear full body armor. I think most parents realize there is no way to take all of the danger out of the game.

You can "what if" the point to eternity, but MLB does now require the base coaches to wear helmets. The NHL regulates the curve on the end of a hockey stick to control the speed of the puck off a slap shot. I bring up these two points only to illustrate not even professional players are thrown out there with a "geez I hope nobody gets hurt" attitude. Precautions are taken in every sport to protect the players realizing that not every accident, bump, bruise, broken bone, and in some sports fatality, can be prevented.

Over tha fence, this is a discussion that many people before us have said has no end. I agree with you, if masks are mandated what next. Again it boils down to want a mask, wear a mask.

[Bring it]

I would guess there is not a loud cry in baseball because the F1 F3 and F5 don't play so close to the hitter and the fake bunt/swing away is not as popuar. Also, in regards to your point about baseball, MLB does not allow aluminum/composite bats due to the dangers posed to the pitcher, and remember baseball pitchers have been killed from line drives to the head from aluminum/composite bats. Don't forget, last year a base coach in the baseball minor leagues (90 feet away) was killed by a line drive off a wooden bat. Will masks ever be mandatory, probably not. Are they a good idea, Hell Yes!

We are finally getting somewhere with this argument. We could pine away all day and night about the stats and distances and types of bats used. We can try to justify or not why baseball and softball are different, but really they aren't. The same dangers of the games are there no matter what age or level of play.

The SEC conference (Softball) requires all Base Coaches to wear a batters helmet to protect against foul balls. This is due to an unfortunate accident that happened in a minor league baseball game. So, how many of you coaches wear a batters helmet? Isn't a bit of a double standard to make your girls wear a mask when you yourself don't set the safety equipment example?

If bats are the problem, then why not the balls? Why not soften the core?
If the fake bunt/swing away is the problem, then why not remove it from the game?
If reaction time is the problem for a pitcher, the why not move the pitching rubber to 46 feet?

Just because a kid wears a mask does not mean they will avoid the dangers of the game.
They will be there no matter what.

I appreciate a civil response, for once.
Safety in the game is important, but it isn't as simple as wearing shin pads or a mask.

I do not think anyone has suggested that it is as easy as wearing a mask or a shin guard. However, I have seen several comments where individuals have stated where the facemask has protected their daughter or one of the DD's teammates. The point is to protect young girls who are playing a GAME from life-long major injuries. It is our responoisbility as adults to protect our children. Once they become 18 it becomes the choice of the DD. Unfortunately, many parents do not believe in protecting their DD because they place a higher value on a GAME. The coaches are grown adults responsible FOR THEIR OWN ACTIONS.

One can cloud the argument by bringing topics such as shin guard protectors, but injuries to the shin are likely not going to risk life long effects such as brain damage or vision problems that can occur from a shot to the head or face. I doubt it seriously that the coach hit in the head would have died had he been hit in an unguarded shin.

The points brought out by Dunder_Mifflin are correct, but I think they are common sense arguments that been driving the individuals in support of the mask to push for the mask to be worn.

[anonlooker]

If ASA and other orgs felt this was an issue, they would mandate masks, just as they did for batters. And then everyone would where them as required, like batters do now.

You can come up with countless "what if" arguments for numerous potential injury scenarios, just as many of you are for the face mask, but the fact is that until the incidence of injuries becomes demonstrably prevalent, there won't be any changes. And since no one seems to be able to show any statistics to support a mandate, there won't be one. Until then, everyone has a choice.

Pretty simple. You do what you want, I'll do what I want. You don't force me to do what I don't want, and I won't try to force you to do what you don't want to.

And let's leave the "You'll be sorry" guilt trip BS out of it, can we? Your not my mother!

[tex]

Yes we can debate this facemask topic forever without getting any where. People can get seriously injured or killed walking down the street. A foul ball can hit someone and seriously injure them or as what happened a couple of weeks ago players can be injured while warming up.

As a person said earlier we are not talking about growns up here, we are talking about kids that are not mature, there reflexes are not as fast as they should be there attention span and focus is not always where it should be. These children, the parents and coaches have the respondibilitiy of protecting them from injury. So, if a product is out there, that will help protect just 1 child from serious injury or possible death, then why not use it???

What if every coach like phan8 said, no child at 1st 3rd or pitcher, will play for me unless they wear a mask ??? What would you parents, as anti-mask parents, do then ? I do conmmend that coach for taking that stand.

Yes, we cannot protect a child from every injury out there, but we can use common sense and use the products that are available.

Coaches you need to take a stronger stand like the phan8 coach does. Follow his lead.

[SoCalASABlue]

Last post on masks - as I have already stated, they should not be mandatory and organizations/leagues should make parents sign those waivers for proper indemnification.

But in reading many of the responses, including the following, I can't help but notice a very common but sad theme:

"Maybe the old school approach to the game is just that. Some of us cavemen and women still believe in teaching the fundamentals of the game. There are many more than a few of us out there. That includes how to pitch and properly taking ground balls and fly balls."

It's about keeping the players safe - it's not about YOU. Your perceived great coaching is not going to make up for the one time that something actually happens - but at least you'll be able to say "her fault she forgot what I taught her, not mine" as the stretcher comes onto the field.

[Ovr_tha_Fence]

It's about keeping the players safe - it's not about YOU. Your perceived great coaching is not going to make up for the one time that something actually happens - but at least you'll be able to say "her fault she forgot what I taught her, not mine" as the stretcher comes onto the field.

Here we go with the dramatic. You guys really like to embellish here.

You are an umpire, I would expect that you would always think that you are right and want the last word AND see something that really isn't there.

You are assuming that I'm a bad guy and that's just wrong period.

[Bring it]

It's about keeping the players safe - it's not about YOU. Your perceived great coaching is not going to make up for the one time that something actually happens - but at least you'll be able to say "her fault she forgot what I taught her, not mine" as the stretcher comes onto the field.

Here we go with the dramatic. You guys really like to embellish here.

You are an umpire, I would expect that you would always think that you are right and want the last word AND see something that really isn't there.

You are assuming that I'm a bad guy and that's just wrong period.

Ovr_tha_Fence:

I may be wrong, but I do not see where the Blue assumes you are a bad guy. Take this away from the current discussion and put in any topic and I, or Blue, can disagree with your view without thinking you are a bad guy. From what I am reading he thinks you are making a bad discision. I happen to agree with him on this topic, but that does not mean anyone thinks you are a bad guy.

As far seeing something that is not there, just because it has not happened to you personally, does not mean that Blue "is seeing something that is not there". My daughter has not been hit directly in the face, knock on wood, but I have seen a few girls take a direct shot on other teams where the mask made a huge difference.

There was a time when cars were constantly speeding through my neighborhood and I complained many times to the police that they needed to get a grip on this or someone was going to be hurt. Nothing had happened, YET, so they would not put up stop signs and very seldom patrolled the street. Unfortunately, a kid was hit by a car as I was afraid of happening and very shortly after that two stop signs were placed along the street, and the streets were patrolled more often. If only they had been PROACTICE instead of REACTIVE.

[SoCalASABlue]

Ovr_tha_fence, I do not think you're a bad guy. I just think we - as parents, coaches, etc. - sometimes do not properly take into consideration the effects of improved technology. Everyone has seen the chain e-mails about the old days, where we rode without bicycle helmets, drank out of the faucet or hose, etc. We're still here so we don't understand why today's kids need so much bubble wrap sometimes. But when I was a kid, I never read about kids taking guns to school to solve problems with bullies either. Times change and not always for the better.

I agree with you that the best defense against that line shot is being in the correct position to field the ball. I don't think anyone - certainly not me - would say that wearing a mask is a substitute for proper defensive technique. I just respectfully disagree that wearing a mask is somehow a crutch or a sign of weakness.

[dittoz]

I have my opinion on masks and none of you care about it

That being said...
How many of you are this passionate about masks on batters either pro or con?
Does it make them more confident as hitters?
How many batters get hit in the mask as opposed to being hit on the helmet?
What do high-level college coaches say about ASA/High School batters with masks as opposed to collegiate players without?

and lastly...

If it were an option, would you suggest to your kid that they do not need a mask on their batting helmet?

[doittoit]

just thought i would keep this on the front page

pro mask
con mask

make your dd wear it you dumba$$es